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Ren
QUOTE
Sony Corp.and games manufacturer Activision Blizzard Inc. were sued by a company that claims “World of Warcraft” and other online games use its inventions. Also named in the complaint filed by PalTalk Holdings Inc. were NCsoft Corp., South Korea’s biggest online-game maker and developer of the “Guild Wars” series of games; U.K. developer Jagex Ltd., maker of the “Runescape” online game; and Turbine Inc., which has a “Lord of the Rings” online game.

Source: http://economy.kansascity.com/?q=node/3863

According to http://www.rfcexpress.com/lawsuit.asp?id=50310 the company is claiming an infringement under USC 35 271. That portion of the United States Code is for Infringement of Patents:
QUOTE
Except as otherwise provided in this title, whoever without authority
makes, uses, offers to sell, or sells any patented invention, within the
United States, or imports into the United States any patented invention
during the term of the patent therefor, infringes the patent.

Whoever actively induces infringement of a patent shall be liable as an
infringer...

Source: http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/pac/mpep/27.txt
urantis
They've also sued Microsoft for taking "inventions" that Microsoft had in Halo.
They sure have "invented" alot.

Who are they anyway?
Hoboh
If only Google made MMO's...then they would get sued and the person slapping the lawsuit on them would quickly disappear and everything would be okay for everybody.
Ren
QUOTE (urantis @ Sep 15 2009, 09:55 PM) *
They've also sued Microsoft for taking "inventions" that Microsoft had in Halo.
They sure have "invented" alot.

Who are they anyway?

According to their blurb (source):
QUOTE
Paltalk is the premier provider of software and technology for real-time, rich media, interactive social networking and is the owner of 10 Patents with a number of additional Patents Pending. The Paltalk platform powers the largest collection of video based communities and continues to grow since it was launched in 1998. Paltalk now boasts millions of active members with nearly 100,000 people simultaneously chatting in rooms engaged in lively dialogues, meeting new friends, discussing the stock market, singing karaoke, and attending family reunions. The Paltalk community is vibrant due to the high quality of the room environments supported by a range of free moderation tools. In addition, Paltalk delivers original programming geared to the interests of the community. Paltalk Interactive events have hosted such entertainment celebrities as William Shatner and radio personalities Opie and Anthony, among others. Paltalk supports IM pals on AOL, Yahoo, and ICQ and is available as a free download.


I wonder if this is related at all to Jagex's not-super-recent vacancy for an in-house lawyer.
EliteZeon
QUOTE
Paltalk is a service that allows users to communicate via instant messaging, voice and video chat. It offers thousands of chat rooms and the ability for users to create their own on any topic. Paltalk is available in two formats: PaltalkScene and PaltalkExpress.
...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PalTalk

*scratches head*

Bah - Posted seconds after Ren.

Seeing what they specialize in... If I think they are suing over what I think they are... then I find this really retarded...
Dracul
most likely it is related..the lawyer thing i mean...but what i don't get is... this

QUOTE
The Paltalk community is vibrant due to the high quality of the room environments supported by a range of free moderation tools. In addition, Paltalk delivers original programming geared to the interests of the community


It seems to me that by their own admission...the things that they develop are for the general community, though while their statement of Community is extremely vague, it seems to me that if it is released to the public, for the public to utilize, then It is then free for the public to use without fear of reprisal...and the lawsuit is very vague as well.. what is it exactly that paltak is suing Jagex and all these other industry giants for?
Ren
The filing indicates it is related to Case 2:06-cv-00367-DF which is the recently resolved PalTak vs Microsoft case. This makes me think it is the same primary patent (5,822,523) which is for "Server-group messaging system for interactive applications" (they filed for it in February 1996).

The abstract states:
QUOTE
A method for deploying interactive applications over a network containing host computers and group messaging servers is disclosed. The method operates in a conventional unicast network architecture comprised of conventional network links and unicast gateways and routers. The hosts send messages containing destination group addresses by unicast to the group messaging servers. The group addresses select message groups maintained by the group messaging servers. For each message group, the group messaging servers also maintain a list of all of the hosts that are members of the particular group. In its most simple implementation, the method consists of the group server receiving a message from a host containing a destination group address. Using the group address, the group messaging server then selects a message group which lists all of the host members of the group which are the targets of messages to the group. The group messaging server then forwards the message to each of the target hosts. In an interactive application, many messages will be arriving at the group server close to one another in time. Rather than simply forward each message to its targeted hosts, the group messaging server aggregates the contents of each of messages received during a specified time period and then sends an aggregated message to the targeted hosts. The time period can be defined in a number of ways. This method reduces the message traffic between hosts in a networked interactive application and contributes to reducing the latency in the communications between the hosts.
Shado
So PalTalk is suing them for having chat boxes in there games...?
Ren
QUOTE (Shado @ Sep 15 2009, 10:08 PM) *
So PalTalk is suing them for having chat boxes in there games...?

I think it'd be for Clan Chat and would only infringe if it queued then sent the message in time-related batches, but considering how vaguely the patent is written then merely having a chat box might be sufficient to infringe. Situations such as this one where a company can get a patent on something quite obvious and then sue people over it is one of the many reasons I'm against software patents.
EliteZeon
QUOTE (Shado @ Sep 15 2009, 05:08 PM) *
So PalTalk is suing them for having chat boxes in there games...?

That is what I believe...

Chat in all games is a universal idea... I really find calling thievery over universal ideas as a big face palm.
I
I swear to jebus, If this ends up delaying MechScape a single second, some one from PalTalk is going to die. >=(
PoultryChamp
Microsoft is behind it, no surprises there. I doubt they'll get it through.

This is a serious case of when patents go terribly, terribly wrong.
Ren
QUOTE (PoultryChamp @ Sep 15 2009, 10:29 PM) *
This is a serious case of when patents go terribly, terribly wrong.

Have software patents ever gone right?
PoultryChamp
QUOTE (Ren @ Sep 15 2009, 02:31 PM) *
QUOTE (PoultryChamp @ Sep 15 2009, 10:29 PM) *
This is a serious case of when patents go terribly, terribly wrong.

Have software patents ever gone right?

Not really.

I could argue about patents and copyrights, but that'd be an entirely new argument to begin with (I welcome anyone to start this argument ; ) ).
Ren
QUOTE (PoultryChamp @ Sep 15 2009, 10:35 PM) *
I could argue about patents and copyrights, but that'd be an entirely new argument to begin with (I welcome anyone to start this argument ; ) ).

Okay, I've created a thread on software patents: http://www.mechscapeworld.com/forums/index...?showtopic=9320
ZarkonisR
I just did a patent search... Found six patents for "Device for removal of adhesive buildup on Paper production machinery", "Improved creping adhesive modifier and process for producing paper", and some other crap... They're a company that makes paper, by the looks of it.


EDIT: I did a search for some patents on the United States Patent Office's website, and I must say, I am not impressed.


Take a look.


QUOTE
1 7,588,661 Absorbent sheet made by fabric crepe process
2 7,585,389 Method of making fabric-creped sheet for dispensers
3 7,585,388 Fabric-creped sheet for dispensers
4 7,503,998 High solids fabric crepe process for producing absorbent sheet with in-fabric drying
5 7,416,637 Low compaction, pneumatic dewatering process for producing absorbent sheet
6 7,399,378 Fabric crepe process for making absorbent sheet


What the hell does this have to do with RuneScape?

Of course, this was from their PalSoft branch, and I haven't yet checked the PalTalk patents. I'll get a conclusive list of this Organization's patents up in a few minutes.


Ah, here we are. The PalTalk branch.

QUOTE
PAT. NO. Title
1 7,206,311 Efficient transmission of data to multiple network nodes
2 6,981,223 Method, apparatus and computer readable medium for multiple messaging session management with a graphical user interface
3 6,807,562 Automatic and selective assignment of channels to recipients of voice chat data
4 6,763,226 MULTIFUNCTIONAL WORLD WIDE WALKIE TALKIE, A TRI-FREQUENCY CELLULAR-SATELLITE WIRELESS INSTANT MESSENGER COMPUTER AND NETWORK FOR ESTABLISHING GLOBAL WIRELESS VOLP QUALITY OF SERVICE (QOS) COMMUNICATIONS, UNIFIED MESSAGING, AND VIDEO CONFERENCING VIA THE INTERNET
5 6,728,358 Efficient buffer allocation for current and predicted active speakers in voice conferencing systems
6 6,683,858 Hybrid server architecture for mixing and non-mixing client conferencing


Let us see here. Efficient transmission of data to multiple network nodes... Umm... The Internet?

Number two... We have... A GUI for a chatbox... Aren't chatboxes supposed to be free-use now?

Moving on to three... We have Voice Chat assignment selection tools. Also been under the Free-Use law for years now. Since the UseNet, I believe.

Numero Quatro... A cell phone. A Cell Phone... They patented a Cell Phone?

Fifth in line, we have... Speaker placement... That fits in with Feng Shui. Unpatentable.

And last... Hybrid Server Architecture. Conferencing. Chat. PUBLIC DOMAIN.

In conclusion, I have come to realize that this company earns the rank of...


AL GORE!

Congratulations, PalTalk. You win the Al Gore "I invented the Internet" Prize. Come up and collect!

In all seriousness... This is balogney! You can't claim patents for half those things.
Robinhoodrs
So let me get this straight, they're sueing Jagex over there Chat Boxes in Runescape?

If so, I hope this doesn't effect Mechscape and it's realse date!
PoultryChamp
QUOTE (Robinhoodrs @ Sep 15 2009, 03:02 PM) *
So let me get this straight, they're sueing Jagex over there Chat Boxes in Runescape?

If so, I hope this doesn't effect Mechscape and it's realse date!

If I was MechScape, I'd laugh in their face and keep chatting.

Where's "I"? That'd be a great idea for another comic.
Dracul
Well their company is what would legally be termed a Patent holding company, technically a shell, their only purpose is to create patents and hold onto them and license those patents out to other companies. It isnt Illegal, nor unethical, at best its annoying and retarded.
ZarkonisR
I can make it... But I'd fail at doing comics.. I'll contact I and see what he can do. kaboom.gif
Gandaf007
The world seems to revolve around the almighty dollar.
ZarkonisR
I've set up a RSOF thread about this, gotten quite a few posts. Have you ever seen a thread hit page 2 in under a minute?


http://forum.runescape.com/c=YmcbNo0a2Ts/f...59581763,goto,1
Pliigi
QUOTE (ZarkonisR @ Sep 15 2009, 03:44 PM) *
I've set up a RSOF thread about this, gotten quite a few posts. Have you ever seen a thread hit page 2 in under a minute?


http://forum.runescape.com/c=YmcbNo0a2Ts/f...15,410,59581699


"What do you do when you die?"

Maybe the wrong thread?
ZarkonisR
Fixed.
Pliigi
QUOTE
Sony Corp.and games manufacturer Activision Blizzard Inc. were sued by a company that claims “World of Warcraft” and other online games use its inventions. Also named in the complaint filed by PalTalk Holdings Inc. were NCsoft Corp., South Korea’s biggest online-game maker and developer of the “Guild Wars” series of games; U.K. developer Jagex Ltd., maker of the “Runescape” online game; and Turbine Inc., which has a “Lord of the Rings” online game.

I think that was taken from the beginning of this article.

QUOTE (Dracul @ Sep 15 2009, 03:10 PM) *
Well their company is what would legally be termed a Patent holding company, technically a shell, their only purpose is to create patents and hold onto them and license those patents out to other companies. It isnt Illegal, nor unethical, at best its annoying and retarded.


Yeah, they bought MPath Interactive, which had originally filed the trademarks, for $200,000...
Max
General patents are stupid as you could have written one down for a car then sue any other 'car' that comes out. They could all be very different but they are 'cars' none the less. What I find annoying is that RuneScape has been out for so long, why are they suing now? They are just proving that they are wanting money left and right here.

They might as well sue about 500 other companies I can think of for make a 'chat box'. Have fun pissing off over 50% of the MMO industry.
Pliigi
QUOTE (Max @ Sep 15 2009, 05:01 PM) *
What I find annoying is that RuneScape has been out for so long, why are they suing now? They are just proving that they are wanting money left and right here.


Exactly. It's not like they're suing every single tiny company that infringes on their patent, they're suing massive, rich companies.

If they actually cared about their patent, not just making money off it, they'd probably have to sue hundreds of companies.
bracol7
Sigh... The patent system desperately needs an overhaul. Much like the music industry... Technology just moves too fast for those law making folk.
Dracul
hmm well, from my understanding of Patents, Patents in themselves grant a Limited monopoly to the patent holder and maker, which means that Patents have a time limit to how long a patent holder can maintain complete and total control over any such variation of the patent and the literal variation of the patent..Once that time limit runs out then others may jump in like hungry wolves and flood the market with their own patent variations..

I really hope the courts throw this petty law suite out the window or into a shredder because if these companes to get slammed with heavy penalties, or any victory at all for Paltek will truly spell a dark age in the era of Patents and technology and the gaming/entertainment industry, and all Industry/business in general
Crash Jordan
This is pretty damn stupid.
Ed5
I like this article about it.
blykon5
QUOTE (Hoboh @ Sep 15 2009, 08:59 PM) *
If only Google made MMO's...then they would get sued and the person slapping the lawsuit on them would quickly disappear and everything would be okay for everybody.

so true lol
Starwars885
... It's ironic how all the clan chats are down in RS atm.
oribital
QUOTE (Starwars885 @ Sep 16 2009, 01:02 PM) *
... It's ironic how all the clan chats are down in RS atm.


are you serious? lol thats stupid.

doesn't this patent or w/e cover things such as msn/ICQ/Skype etc then? their basicly a chat box too.

and how can you create a patent over something so general?

if someone made a patent about computers 100 years ago, then what, no one would be allowed to make computers today?

and i though that you cannot own an idea or so i read somewhere.
this is really confusing -.-
Pliigi
QUOTE (Starwars885 @ Sep 16 2009, 05:02 AM) *
... It's ironic how all the clan chats are down in RS atm.


They're moving servers, I don't think it has any connnection to the lawsuit.
Flatypus
Well we know why they wanted the lawyer. But this sucks >:(
Trunkzta
this is the stupidest thing ive ever heard, Jagex should counter sue . for them being shitheads -.-
Arain321
Wonder if this will effect anything at Jagex.
SleepyMatt
Pretty concerning that Microsoft had to pay them off - even combined, Acti-Blizzard, Jagex and the others are a tiny minnow beside Gates and co. Not to mention that the precedent has already been set, making it all that much harder to defend the lawsuit. I guess MMG better get the chequebook out.... down.gif down.gif mad.gif

*plans patenting "the act of cyclical inspiration/expiration as a method of ensuring efficient gas-exchange in living organisms", and suing the ass off anyone that dares even breathe*

RAWR!
ZarkonisR
I got my patent for the English Language. Muahaha! Now... You all better start speaking Portuguese.
I
QUOTE (ZarkonisR @ Sep 17 2009, 09:28 PM) *
I got my patent for the English Language. Muahaha! Now... You all better start speaking Portuguese.

Merda
Orbie
Oh noes, I only speak English and an embarrassing amount of Latin and French...

But this is a seriously messed up lawsuit. It's like having a patent on breathing - or a language ^^ lol
DjIceman
QUOTE
Mod Mmg
Jagex Mod

17-Sep-2009 17:12:25
Last edited on 17-Sep-2009 19:20:17 by Mod Kelvin
Hi Guys,
Just to bring you up to speed, whilst Paltalk is making as much PR capital as they can on this matter, Jagex have yet to be served with any court papers and I expect being a British company it will probably take a few months before that happens.

Jagex respect all 3rd party IP rights and prides itself on developing all of our own technology which has not only made us a leader in this space but also means we are confident having assessed their patents, that there is no merit to their claims and this is all simply the work of ambulance chasers trying to extort money from a successful games studio.

Naturally I can’t speak for Activision or Sony, but it goes without saying that we will vigorously defend ourselves against any claims and whilst it may take a number of months or possibly even years for Jagex to triumph, there is no doubt we will triumph. The accusations will not affect Jagex’s operation in any way nor stop us continuing to create the world’s best online games.

Cheers,
Mark Gerhard


http://forum.runescape.com/c=VPZMMq-e7rU/f...5,highlight,#83

Lul-ness. It was edited by Mod Kelvin! blink.gif


Thank you
Iceman
oribital
if stuff like this didn't happen, lawyers would not exist :/
DjIceman
QUOTE (oribital @ Sep 18 2009, 02:47 PM) *
if stuff like this didn't happen, lawyers would not exist :/


If stuff like this didn't happen, idiots would not exist either. :P
Max
QUOTE (DjIceman @ Sep 18 2009, 09:18 AM) *
QUOTE
Mod Mmg
Jagex Mod

17-Sep-2009 17:12:25
Last edited on 17-Sep-2009 19:20:17 by Mod Kelvin
Hi Guys,
Just to bring you up to speed, whilst Paltalk is making as much PR capital as they can on this matter, Jagex have yet to be served with any court papers and I expect being a British company it will probably take a few months before that happens.

Jagex respect all 3rd party IP rights and prides itself on developing all of our own technology which has not only made us a leader in this space but also means we are confident having assessed their patents, that there is no merit to their claims and this is all simply the work of ambulance chasers trying to extort money from a successful games studio.

Naturally I can’t speak for Activision or Sony, but it goes without saying that we will vigorously defend ourselves against any claims and whilst it may take a number of months or possibly even years for Jagex to triumph, there is no doubt we will triumph. The accusations will not affect Jagex’s operation in any way nor stop us continuing to create the world’s best online games.

Cheers,
Mark Gerhard


http://forum.runescape.com/c=VPZMMq-e7rU/f...5,highlight,#83

Lul-ness. It was edited by Mod Kelvin! blink.gif


Thank you
Iceman


This is what I thought... Paltalk is trying to make up for lack of innovation. They want a free ride. Cheers Jagex, go win this!
ZarkonisR
I want five dollars from each of you, right now, for using my language.

On a more serious note, though, that was my thread he responded to...
Drachen
QUOTE (ZarkonisR @ Sep 18 2009, 01:07 PM) *
I want five dollars from each of you, right now, for using my language.

On a more serious note, though, that was my thread he responded to...

Would No be English or Spanish?
Dracul
Well it is important to note that..just because you develop your own technologies doesnt mean your not indirectly or accidently copying an existing technology.

So in that regards the law suit will be very interesting.
Stellar
QUOTE (Dracul @ Sep 19 2009, 06:31 PM) *
Well it is important to note that..just because you develop your own technologies doesnt mean your not indirectly or accidently copying an existing technology.

So in that regards the law suit will be very interesting.


Hmm let's see how it will go...

Judge: You're sueing because someone else is using a Chat Box?
PalTalk: Yes, that's right.
Judge: Wow you're stupid. This is the internet we are talking about. Get a life. Case dismissed.
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